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Ragnhild, Folkefilosofen's avatar

… which leaves us with hard core mystic agnostisicism … And here I don’t take agnosticism to mean «sitting-indecisively-on-the-fence» with regards to Gods existence (agnosticism is also fairly ill-defined in daily language), but rather: the «true» agnostic position springs out of a revalation of sorts: The question of Gods existence draws our attention to the limits of our logic, and the fact that the question of Gods existence cannot ever be answered in a way that works in accordance with the demands of logic… (or the demands of crystalline purity).

When we are trapped in the idea that the question of Gods existence must be answered this way, we are commiting a thought error.

Instead, we should ask ourselves: What is a god life? (And as you say: What works?) Are religious practices helping people to lead better, fuller, richer, more connected lives? What are the «best practices», and which practices leads to hatred, division, discrimination, aggressivity, war…

It is not a matter of who occupies the «true belief», it is a question of how to live meaningfully and peacefully together in a world of conflict, hardships and great uncertainty.

This aside, for me personally there cannot be a good life without the feeling of deep awe…

For some strange reason, awe changes everything…

There is a beautiful quote by Bruno Latour: «The world is not a solid continent of facts sprinkled by a few lakes of uncertainties, but a vast ocean of uncertainties speckled by a few islands of calibrated and stabilized forms»

(See Bruno Latour, Reassembling the Social: An Introduction to Actor-Network-Theory)

And I find myself thinking and feeling that this is a beautiful thing… I am without the need for the word «God», but spiritually I need to let «the hardnosed Scepticist» clean my house, and s/he always throws out hardnosed Atheism… and the air just feels cleaner, less polluted…

This post was a great read, Åsmund ❤️ Thank you 🙏

Javas's avatar

Really compelling piece! The “correspondence rules” point is, to me, the sharpest insight: most metaphysical debates stall not because people are bad at logic, but because the mapping from lived language to crisp propositions is underdetermined, and there’s no shared procedure for sharpening it. That feels like the right diagnosis of why Bayes/logic can become decorative once we leave domains where measurement and agreement can actually converge.

From my perspective (naturalism as a disciplined, scale-aware project rather than a closed metaphysical creed), I’d add one caution and one refinement:

Caution: dissolving “natural vs supernatural” entirely risks throwing out a minimal but meaningful distinction: methods that improve their correspondence rules through shared constraints (instrumentation, interoperability, error bars, engineering feedback) versus methods that mainly optimize private/ineffable states. Both can “work,” but they cash out in different currencies and carry different failure modes.

Refinement: “real = what works” is powerful pragmatism, but it helps to stratify works-for-what. Predictive/technological workability is not the same as phenomenological/meaning workability. Treating both as equally “real” is defensible, but only if we keep the layers explicit, otherwise “real” starts to mean “valuable to me,” and the epistemic teeth fall out.

Still, I appreciate the honesty: if a claim can’t be sharpened into something two people could, in principle, converge on, then refusing to assign it a truth value is often the most rational move.

Great read.

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